Transcending Fear With Florida Surgeon General Dr. Joseph Ladapo

What happens when a public health leader refuses to make decisions based on fear?

In this episode, Florida Surgeon General Dr. Joseph Ladapo joins us to discuss the principles that guided him through one of the most turbulent periods in modern medicine. He reflects on his years at UCLA during the COVID-19 pandemic, why he publicly challenged lockdowns and mandates, and what it was like to work alongside Governor Ron DeSantis to chart a different course in Florida.

But this conversation goes far beyond policy.

Dr. Ladapo opens up about the childhood trauma that left him living in a near-constant state of fear, the unexpected healing journey that transformed his life just months before the pandemic began, and how that experience changed the way he practices medicine, understands chronic illness, and approaches leadership.

We also explore Florida’s efforts to investigate contaminants in the food supply, remove fluoride from public water, protect informed consent, and address the environmental factors contributing to today’s chronic disease epidemic.

Throughout this deeply personal and thought-provoking discussion, Dr. Ladapo reminds us that fear narrows our perspective, while wisdom, courage, and connection can help illuminate a better path forward.

Visit Dr. Joseph Ladapo’s website to learn more

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Episode Transcript

Within the below transcript the bolded text is Kendall Nelson and the regular text is Dr. Joseph Ladapo.

What does public health leadership look like in a time of fear? How do you make clear, grounded decisions when political pressure, media outrage, and public panic are pulling society in every direction at once? What if the real challenge of leadership during a crisis isn’t simply following the science, but learning how to think clearly, remain courageous, and transcend fear itself? This is episode 587, and our guest is Dr. Joseph Ladapo. Dr. Ladapo is a Physician, Researcher, and the Surgeon General of Florida. He’s trained at Harvard Medical School with a background in Medicine and Health Policy.

He previously served as a professor at UCLA, where he conducted clinical research and wrote extensively about public health, medicine, and patient care. During the COVID era, his willingness to publicly question lockdowns, mandates, and aspects of vaccine policy placed him at the center of one of the most polarizing periods in modern medicine. In this conversation. Dr. Ladapo shares what he learned navigating public health during a period dominated by fear, uncertainty, and division. Also, why he believes mindful leadership, clarity of thought, and moral courage are essential in moments of crisis.

We discuss the psychological climate of the pandemic and the pressures placed on physicians and public officials. The tension between individual liberty and government of authority, and how fear can shape not only personal decisions, but entire public health systems. Dr. Ladapo reflects on his journey from academia to becoming Florida’s Surgeon General.

The phone call from Governor Ron DeSantis that changed the course of his life and why he believes open scientific debate and independent thinking are more important now than ever before. This is a thoughtful and deeply human conversation about fear, leadership, medicine, resilience, and what it means to stay grounded in truth during turbulent times. I’m Kendall Nelson, and you’re tuning into Wise Traditions.

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Dr. Ladapo, welcome to the show.

Thank you. Thanks for inviting me.

I’m so happy you’re here. I want to start by asking you about your book. You wrote the book Transcend Fear, which was amazing. The first chapter of it is called Getting the Call. I’m curious what you were doing before that call in Los Angeles. What was life like? How did that call change your trajectory?

The Climate Of Crisis And The Call To Serve

I will always remember that day. We lived out in West LA. A beautiful area. It’s a beautiful part of town. For anyone who’s spent time in LA, they know. We were in Brentwood. At that time, I was a professor at UCLA. I mostly did research. I funded research and I also took care of patients. I took care of patients at UCLA Ronald Reagan Hospital. In fact, I was taking care of patients during the week that Governor Gavin Newsom shut down the State of California. I was literally taking care of patients that week, including some patients with COVID-19. I enjoyed UCLA. Two of our boys were born there. It was a nice life. When the pandemic started, it changed a lot of things because I felt very strongly and super strongly that just the way our leaders, our public health officials and some of the executive leadership in the Trump Administration, the way they were doing things was just wrong.

The strategies they were using weren’t in line with what made sense. They weren’t in line with what made humanistic sense, like what will work, what can you get humans to do, and what’s going to fail and blow up in your face. It ended up costing you more than whatever games you think you might achieve. This was happening with the CDC and a lot of states. Almost all state leadership I felt was just doing the wrong thing. The media was energizing and just pumping or fueling the situation with all their hysteria about case counts and things like that.

I started writing to share my perspective. A lot of those articles were published, unfortunately, by the Wall Street Journal. I started out in the USA Today. I had a bunch of pieces in the Wall Street Journal about the lockdown, fear, the culture of fear, loss of sensibility, the vaccines, and how they were unlikely to be a Panacea. We shouldn’t mandate. I was going one direction, and UCLA was going a different direction.

Fear narrows our perspective, shutting out the intelligence and wisdom we need to make healthy choices.

Up to that point, I enjoyed my UCLA career. I still enjoyed it. Things were definitely getting uncomfortable. I was the black sheep in the flock but I was tenured. I’ve done well, and thank goodness because if I hadn’t done well, in terms of winning a lot of NIH research grants, doing good research and having a good publication and some good science.

I would have totally been pressured to stop writing and stop talking. The leadership that UCLA couldn’t say, “You’re not doing your job. You should focus on your job and stop writing and commenting about the pandemic.” I was doing my job, so they couldn’t do that. I was estranged, but I’m still very happy. I got some outreach. I had someone from Governor DeSantis’s office reach out to me about an opening that they had in some job position.

Let’s talk a little bit more about what was going on in Los Angeles at the time. You said that you were writing for the newspapers and trying to get your opinions out. What was being done with the lockdowns and stuff that you disagreed with? What was your prescription for a better way in public health?

Shattering The Illusion Of Lockdowns And Enforced Isolation

I can’t think of a better word than just dystopian. There were so many things that were wrong about the policies that were being implemented in Los Angeles and California more broadly and in the country because everyone, with the exception of Florida, was more or less following the same playbook. The policies were not sensible. One of the first things I wrote about was the fact that if you do a lockdown and eventually have to end the lockdown. You do this thing and you end this thing, then you’re more or less back to where you started. What did it get you?

I disagree completely with lockdowns, like unequivocally, but it would have been one thing if the idea was to use that time like some brief time and then activities resume and life resumes and things like that. As we all saw, it was like a fever. Areas would go into lockdown. Come out of a lockdown and go back. It’s just insane. It was totally crazy. The promotion of separation between people, this is celebrated. It was something that was considered righteous and noble. It was just sick. People need other people. People need connection. People need to live. You can’t just be a rock. You have to engage. You have to drag.

Wise Traditions - Kendall Nelson | Dr. Joseph Ladapo | Medical Freedom — Medical Freedom: As individuals, we are under a constant barrage of environmental stressors—from pesticides to digital inundation. We must learn to become active participants in our own health.

People need those things to have meaning in life and to stay connected to source, to nature, to God, and each other. All of those things were being gutted and maligned. We saw bad behavior because of it. We looked like neighbors stitching on neighbors. People fighting over wearing a mask. If I remember correctly, there were even some shootings. People getting killed over conflicts about masking. It was a very subversive campaign against the human spirit.

If that wasn’t about enough, we already knew what populations were at greatest risk. Certainly, there were young people that got sick tragically. Every person who gets sick is sad. A very sad occurrence. Overall, in terms of the risks that people face. There was clearly a much higher concentration of risk than people who were older. Yet, that wasn’t recognized. It wasn’t reflected in public policy.

It was just bad after bad. There was a shortage of bad decisions and bad policies during that time. My wife and I felt it was important to say something. Fortunately, the Wall Street Journal was willing to be a voice for that perspective, specifically James Toronto. He was the Editor in Chief. He accepted a lot of the things I sent him. He also gave me a lot of feedback to improve the work. All that worked out well.

I admire you so much for your bravery and for having done those writings. The bad policy making and stuff. How much do you think it was? The politicians were trying to flex their power or control the population rather than what they thought at the time was based on science.

I almost want to say there were equal parts of each. Politics is largely a fear-based industry. Fear is a powerful motivation for a lot of political activity. That was very strong. The force was quite strong in that respect. A lot of leaders were afraid to step out from the mainstream to be blamed for any bad outcomes that happened. As if we ever had that much control over what would happen during the pandemic in the early days.

When public health policies enforce separation instead of connection, they wage a campaign against the human spirit.

There was a lot of fear. A lot of people who didn’t want to be cold and called names by Rachel Maddow or other people on television for their decisions. Fortunately, Governor Santos was literally the sole exception to that. The other thing that politics attracts are people who have an unhealthy relationship with power and crave it and need it. It’s almost like a drug.

Those people also saw an opportunity in this pandemic. Maybe not so much fear with them. From pictures I saw some of them would come on vacation in Florida, for example, while they were implementing crushing brutal policies for their people back home. They go and have nice dinners at The French Laundry and restaurants like that, but that was a part of it for some people. This opportunity to satiate that desire for power, for control and to flex. That was part of the picture, too.

How did it feel when you accepted the job to be Surgeon General of Florida? You gave your first press conference there. How did it feel to be saying, “We’re not going to make decisions out of fear. We’re going to base them on data?” Can you tell me a little bit about that? I want to know what policy it was that you implemented that very day.

It was surreal because it was completely not part of my game plan in terms of the trajectory my life would take. I thought I was going to say UCLA until the old man. I didn’t think we’re ever going to leave. UCLA is a great university, and things were going well, so I didn’t think we’re ever going to leave. Everything about it was unexpected but it also felt right. It felt good to be able to voice my perspective. It was very interesting. That was the very day working with Governor DeSantis and members of his team. We implemented a policy related to, I believe, masking basically and the ability of schools to force students to do that. I think the other one had to do with excluding students from school but I have to check my notes to remember the order that we signed that day.

I know one thing you did for sure was that you made it so that if a student was exposed to somebody with COVID. Somebody that tested positive ever had COVID, so then they didn’t have to go in quarantine. That was great. I want to switch gears a little bit and talk about your book. You wrote Transcend Fear, and you talked a lot about the power of fear. Can you just tell me a little bit about your own experience? I know, in the book, you said that you’ve spent quite a bit of your life living in fear. Talk to me about that.

The Frigid Temperature Of Fear And How It Blinds Leadership

It’s extra ironic in the position where I am now. I used to live in a state that is completely opposite from the state I live in now. I had a dramatic experience when I was a little kid. I didn’t know at the time, but it filled my heart with fright. One of my mentors is a gentleman named Christopher Maher who was a former Navy SEAL, and he’s a healer. He’s a guy that I had the blessing of being able to finally work with in December of 2019. He talks about and almost characterizes, but he talks about emotions and temperature.

Fear has a cold temperature and fright has a frigid temperature. A much colder temperature. I had a dramatic experience when I was a little boy that filled my heart with fright. I didn’t know at the time. I thought everything was fine because I thought everything was fine but it strangled or choked off my ability to emotionally connect with other people. Again, I was walking around and grew up thinking everything was fine.

I was severely something like disabled. I was just quite deeply dysfunctional emotionally. I had no idea. Part of the reason I had no idea is because brains work for the benefit of our survival. Our brains will contort reality in whatever way is needed to help us survive. My brain subconsciously, unconsciously got to work to do that to manage the experience that I had and make it possible for me to continue to function.

Apparently, what so conscious or unconscious decided to do was to dead that ability to emotionally connect with other people. With the fright, I truly just was very fearful. I was in a constant state of fear of everything such as speaking out in a crowd. From looking different in any way, I was frightful. It was the frequency that defined my life. Eventually, I got to work with Christian Maher and unwind, roll back the clock and do some very extremely powerful.

I believe that you worked with him right before the pandemic happened. You were in this position where you had done the self-work and your book, you wrote that you had lost 98% of your fear when you were done working with him and then the pandemic hit. You then have this reasonable voice that’s not coming out of fear. You’re able to look at the pandemic differently than so many other of our leaders or public health officials. Why is it so dangerous for our public health officials to be making decisions based out of fear?

Adding medication to a public water supply without individual consent is a clear violation of personal sovereignty.

That’s right. The timing was undoubtedly God’s timing to have that experience. None of the things I did after that would have been possible if I had never experienced it. It’s bad for public health officials. It’s bad for Governors, presidents, and everyone to be making decisions from fear. It’s bad because it’s impossible to make a decision that serves your interests or whatever your goal is, to the highest possible benefit if you’re making it out of fear.

The reason is because just literally, as humans, we have access to lots of different types of intelligence, different types of emotions, and all these things come together and create who we are. With fear, what happens is, you shut out 99% of everything else that you have access to. You see the issue or the decision or the situation through a very limited lens compared to your ability to view the situation if you have all your faculties.

If you’re working with less, it’s impossible to be more. It’s impossible to do better if you’re starting from a smaller place than what you are and then who you are. I did see that with public health officials. There were other issues there too with public health officials that relate to the type of training they receive and some of the belief systems that are part of that training. Those were factors also, but certainly fear was a major factor and a factor that was supported, maintained, and incentivized by the media.

It’s probably hard to describe briefly, but what was it that Christopher Maher did for you or helped you work through in order to release that fear?

Very briefly, I’ll share. The things I’m saying were not things that I even believed were possible or true before working with him. Now, I know that they are possible. They are true. His techniques are grounded in Chinese medicine theory and then he’s developed some additional techniques from his own intuition, God’s wisdom for us. God’s gift to us. In Chinese medicine theory, part of the beliefs about being in health and wellness have to do with meridians.

These channels of energy of chi that traverse the body. They run throughout our body and they run to different organs. Each organ has its own type of intelligence. For example, the kidneys are the place of fear or fearlessness. The lungs have to do with boundaries. The liver can be a place of anger. The pancreas and some other organs are related to judgment. The colon is related to your ability to purge or to process and to move things out or to move emotions out. Each organ has its own type of intelligence.

The problem that we encounter is that the stress and the tension that we experience daily builds, accumulates, and stores information in our bodies, and it restricts the passage. It reduces the passage of chi. As we put more stress, tension, and trauma in our bodies, we have less and less chi flowing through our bodies, literally life, energy, and from God. We have less access to the innate intelligence that lives in all of our bodies.

Through a lot of physical manipulation much of which is like, extremely painful initially, and then later becomes less painful. Also, through some forms of meditation and spiritual meditation. He’s worked with thousands of other people to get the stress and attention and the trauma out of my body. Thereby, increase in the flow of chi and restore things to the way that they’re intended to be. The closer we are to being reflections of God, that’s a good direction to go, and that type of work allows you to do.

You’re making my heart sing talking about Chinese medicine and meridians and all of these wonderful things. It’s making me think about what doctor were you prior to releasing your fear as opposed to how you look at medicine now?

I tried to be the best doctor I could be always. I practice just like I was trained. I was Western medicine trained, allopathic medicine. That’s what I did. I tried to be compassionate. Post-Christopher, some other things changed. Since I was able to remove, everyone’s going to perform better when they carry less stress and less impact from trauma. Everything gets better. Your body works better. You have less pain. Your immune system works better. You have more clearly and you have more intelligence. Your intuition works better. Your ability to see things and understand where people are coming from, what their motivations, fears, aspirations, and intentions are. All of that becomes easier.

In patient encounters, I was able to carry that into patient encounters when I was at UCLA, for example. You also have more awareness of yourself. You have a better sense when maybe a patient is saying something that is triggering you. You’re somehow stirring some unresolved issues in you and being aware of that. Most people, for example, live in this space where there’s all this projection. It becomes difficult for people to see the way they’re acting is a reaction to something that is now in the field or being expressed by the person.

Escaping Allopathic Limitations To Restore Innate Healing

People then direct their anger or irritation or agitation toward that person. Whereas, it’s something that’s happening inside of the cells. All of that helps you improve your performance very obviously. It also makes everything fun, which is great. It’s great to be able to have more fun in life. All of those things are important. Another piece that’s been important for me is that it’s just completely opened my eyes to how parochial and limited allopathic medicine is.

There are lots of wonderful things without allopathic medicine. If you’re in a car accident and you break a femur. Wonderful things. Orthopedic surgeon with high success rates, particularly for acute illness and trauma but there are also tremendous limitations. Particularly in primary care. When we’re talking about things like anxiety, depression, difficulty sleeping, pain, or chronic pain. Its major limitations with our ability to address underlying causes of disease. The work that I did with Christopher has opened my receptiveness to different ways of thinking about healing.

You mentioned the underlying causes of chronic illness. I know in Florida, you’ve got a new program where you’re testing foods and things like baby formula and bread and all these other foods. Tell me about that program. What are you finding?

True physical, emotional, and spiritual healing starts when we begin to unburden our bodies of stored stress and trauma.

Exposing Ultra-Processed Toxins Hidden In Our Food Supply

We’re doing this great program with First Lady Casey DeSantis, Governor DeSantis’ wife. Part of her motivation is that she’s a young woman and she was diagnosed with breast cancer a few years ago. When anyone is diagnosed with cancer, but particularly a young person. You wonder why. You’re like, “How did this happen to me? Why is this happening to me?” Part of her exportation to put more attention on environmental exposures and particularly, the things that we eat and how those influence our health.

We’ve seen Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and the MAHA Movement. There’s been a lot more attention on that. Fortunately, the level of awareness and the consciousness of how sadly poisonous so much of our environment is and how we even got here. The fact that we’re so far removed from real food. The stuff that comes from the earth or is growing because of things from the earth. We’re talking about cows and other types of meat. How far removed we are from that to what is usually in the diet for so many Americans.

I’m incredibly grateful that we have more awareness on that. More people are asking questions about that. First Lady Casey DeSantis has been working with us in the Department of Health to do testing of maybe commonly consumed foods. We’ve been looking for metals in many foods. We’ve been looking for pesticides like glyphosate. We have a lot more testing to unveil. We have many more results to share. Some of the findings so far have been absolutely very concerning.

What will you do with those results? Will you share those with everybody, with the people of Florida? How will people find out that these foods are bad for them? What’s the plan?

I’ll say two things. First, we were posting the results on a website called Exposing Food Toxins. People can look at the results there. Secondly, we’ve been working with partners, when possible, to both increase the awareness of some of these findings. Frankly, to pressure people to do the right things. Pressure organizations to do the right things. That’s been our strategy. That involves some behind-the-work maneuvering to incentivize some manufacturers to pay more attention to some of the contaminants. It’s been about public education and inclusive attention on these issues.

You’ve also been doing some work with getting fluoride out of the water. Is that true? Can you tell me about that?

The Philosophical Victory Of Removing Water Fluoridation

Fortunately, we have successfully done that in Florida, in terms of, legislative victory, if you will. Now, in Florida, water stations can no longer add fluoride to the drinking water. There’s naturally current fluoride that levels in different areas. The addition of fluoride to drinking water is something that is fortunately can’t happen anymore Florida. It’s a big important way. Scientifically, there was ScanFort support in the current ERA that was better evidence in the past in terms of any dental benefits from fluoridation or from adding fluoride to water.

There’s a Cochrane review that shows that there’s basically no evidence for it now. Perhaps because nutrition has changed. Perhaps because there’s wider availability of toothpaste with fluoride or perhaps a combination of different factors. Ultimately, it’s not scientifically as a policy strategy supported anymore. Philosophically, I personally think that it’s wrong to medicate people unless you have their consent. If you’re adding fluoride to everyone’s water, you’re medicating people. You’re doing it without their consent. Since individual consent is obtained for that. Scientifically, it’s a win. Philosophically, it’s a win also.

You mentioned consent. I work for the Weston A. Price Foundation as their vaccine consultant. I also made the movie Greater Good about the vaccine controversy. It’s something that’s close to my heart. I’m very concerned about the idea of mandating vaccines. What is happening in Florida regarding vaccines?

Not as much as I would like, but we’ve been trying. We’ve had a lot of great success. For example, Governor DeSantis in particular, has led efforts to prohibit schools and places of employment from mandating vaccinations without providing exemptions. That’s important. That’s unique here in Florida and it’s because of Government DeSantis’ leadership that that’s been possible and the lawmakers. A lot of lawmakers are supportive. Some of the lawmakers are not so supportive. It has nothing to do with Republican or Democrat.

Why Personal Sovereignty Demands Defending Informed Consent

That’s been something that has been achieved. I’m with you with the mandates. That, unfortunately, we have not been able to achieve yet. I’m hopeful that it will be achieved because it’s a moral and ethical position. This whole mandating vaccine is profoundly unethical. It’s a total violation of the sovereignty of people to control what goes into the bodies. It’s completely unethical. We’re working with Governor DeSantis’ office here at the Department of Health. We attempted to support legislation that would end vaccine mandates in Florida Statutes.

We were not successful in doing that. There were barriers to succeeding with that goal. That’s the overall state there. Fortunately, we still have pretty robust exemption opportunities here. Unfortunately, many of the educational institutions pretend as though those don’t exist. The language that’s used is frankly course often. Often, there’s no mention of an opportunity to see an exemption even though that is legally protected in Florida Statutes.

We must demand open scientific debate and independent thinking if we want to build a truly healthy society.

We periodically receive complaints about having different types of institutions who are forcing vaccines. We have to do outreach and we work with Floridians who are in those situations. Many Floridians just go along when they get into these courses of situations because they may not know that they have the right to say no.

I know here in Sun Valley and Idaho, where I live, as my child was growing up. I was watching what was happening in town and they would print in the newspaper every year all of the mandated vaccines that were needed for school. Yet, here in Idaho, we have philosophical, religious and medical exemptions. It was just out wrong what they were printing. I can imagine that as a parent, you would read that and you would think that my kid can’t go to school without the vaccine.

I completely agree with you. It’s dishonest and it’s intentional.

What else are you working on in Florida? As Surgeon General, what is on the top of your list?

We have some epidemiological studies that I can’t say too much about, but they are in the works on some very important health issues. My hope is that, over the next months, we’ll be releasing more information about those. We’re also doing some other work related to the use of medications in children for conditions like depression or attention deficit or hyperactivity disorder. We also have been working with some very motivating and interesting colleagues’ issues related to radio frequency radiation and some of the potential health impacts of that so important. A number of things, in the hopper, if you will.

If you were to say like what’s the biggest problem now? As far as chronic illness goes. Paint me a picture of what the country is like now. What’s the state of everybody’s health? What would be some remedies that you might suggest?

Identifying The Assaults On Modern Health

As individuals, we’re under a lot of different environmental stressors like very meaningful stuff. We’ve talked already about issues with pesticides and issues with the yawning distance between what is coming from the earth and what we’re putting in our bodies. That’s huge. That’s irresponsible for a substantial proportion of illness. Consumption happens in different ways. It’s not just what we put in our mouths.

Another major area that is a challenge for health and is an environmental exposure is the role that social media and digital information and digital life is playing the seduction of artificial intelligence. The supplementation of human skills for things that potentially a machine can do and the inundation with digital stimulus like notifications and social media postings and all that. Those are major challenges. There are a number of different types of environmental challenges that are assaults or threats to human physical health, human mental health, human emotional health, and human spiritual health. It’s all happening all at once.

What would you wish for everybody to be? How would you like to see people living their lives?

It takes me back to the discussion that we had about Christopher Maher. Challenge is finding the way. Most everyone wants to do good for themselves and to do good for the people around them, the people they love and the world more generally, but the challenge is finding the way. All of these things that we just mentioned, not only are they not good for our health, but they also disrupt our ability to connect to ourselves and to source. It’s all tied in, tied together.

My dream is to be able to bring more of these types of tools that help people unburden their stress, tension, and their trauma and to bring more access to those types of tools because they literally will solve everything. As people carry less of those types of stressors, tension, and trauma, they have more connection to themselves. They have wisdom, more knowledge, and more awareness. It’s easier to find the way forward.

I believe we’ll literally fix every problem that we have that we face because we have that ability within ourselves. Particularly when we have a good sense of what direction we should go, what direction aligns with our spiritual beings and our connection to source. That’s my hope and dream. It’s something that I think about frequently. I don’t know how I might be able to make it happen or might be able to help support other people and make it happen. That is the solution because it starts from within. It starts from us. It allows us to find a way to navigate all the problems around these.

Let me just ask you a couple more questions and I’ll let you go. I know you’re very busy. If you turn on the news these days, hearing about the hantavirus on the cruise ship and we’re hearing about Ebola breakouts. It seems to me like this is a perfect opportunity to make sure that we don’t make any decisions based in fear. Do you have anything that you can add to that?

It’s all challenging stuff. Some of these viruses aren’t pretty scary. I will tell you for some of them. It’s interesting. Of all people, I personally think that everyone who wants to do the work to do the work. Whether you’re doing it yourself in meditation or doing it by exercising or by spending time reading or spending more time with your loved ones. Whatever it is that you enjoy that makes you feel happier. All of that is all connected.

I want that for everyone, but it’s important for our leaders. Our leaders are the people who are the frontier. At the forefront of these issues and who are making decisions that affect the lives of others. Ultimately, I wrote that my book, too. It’s important, in my opinion, for leaders who want to serve powerfully to find some way to work on themselves. It’s going to serve you and every crisis, including the ones that we are currently facing. It remains to be seen how much of an issue these issues will be. I’m not sure how it’s going to go. Certainly, I’m not sure how these viruses will go, but I’m not sure how our ability as leader is to respond to the challenge is going to go either.

I want to also ask you very quickly about working with Ron DeSantis. Can you just give me your thoughts on how’s the relationship going now that you guys are working together?

I have a very good relationship with Governor DeSantis. He’s a results like practical, data-driven guy. Obviously, he has to have political considerations. I don’t think you could be a successful politician without that. He uniquely has a very strong desire to do what’s right. Certainly, over these last few years, when we’ve been working together. We’ve done a lot of things together that were not popular according to CNN and the hosts at NBC and the New York Times and other media figures.

They’ve been doing the right thing. He’s been completely willing to do that, which is extraordinary. Extraordinary for any political leader that we have in this country. That’s worked out well. He did that before I came here, which I was glad I was able to come and help advance his vision and his intention in that area. He’s a dad of three kids. It’s sweet to watch him with his kids because it’s a tough job. Being Governor, he’s like always under attack, but he gets to chill when he’s with his kids. It’s very sweet. He’s a good man. It’s definitely been a privileging a gift to work with that.

That’s wonderful. I want to wrap up by asking the question that I ask all of my guests at the end of the show. That is, if you could just do one thing to improve your health, what should we do?

The Ultimate Prescription For Vibrant Health

Eat as much real food as possible and as little processed food as possible. I would say that because it’s all connected. All the processed foods, the things that are in the processed food, the contaminants and all of that, not only do they hurt you physically, but they hurt you mentally. Indeed, they do hurt you emotionally and spiritually. If I could have a few things, all I want is to have more things, but a central hub, if you will. That’s the one thing that I would do. Hopefully, it would help with pain. It would help with energy and then you could find other ways to improve your home from there.

Dr. Ladapo, thank you so much for being with us here. I appreciate your perspective and I want to make the announcement that you are going to be speaking at the Weston A. Price Conference in October 2026 as the keynote speaker. Everybody will have to come and see you in person.

I’m looking forward to it.

Thank you.

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Our guest was Dr. Joseph Ladapo. You can learn more about his work, his public health initiatives in Florida, and his ongoing efforts to bring greater transparency and integrity to medicine by visiting the Florida Department of Health. You can also learn more through his book Transcend Fear, where he explores mindful leadership, resilience, and how to remain grounded during times of uncertainty and crisis.

This conversation was a powerful reminder that leadership during times of crisis requires far more than expertise alone. It requires courage, clarity, discernment, and the ability to remain grounded when fear begins driving the conversation. Dr. Ladapo challenged us to think more deeply about the culture of modern public health. The pressure is placed on physicians and scientists, and what can happen when questioning dominant narrative becomes professionally or socially dangerous.

We also explored the importance of personal responsibility, open scientific debate, and the need for humility in medicine, especially during uncertain times when the consequences of public policy affect millions of lives. At the end of the day, this conversation invites us to step back from fear-based thinking to become more thoughtful consumers of information and to remember that preserving human freedom, dignity, and independent thought are essential components of a healthy society. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with a friend. Leave us a review and consider supporting the Weston A. Price Foundation. Thank you so much for tuning in. Be well, be nourished, and be free.

About Dr. Joseph Ladapo

Joseph A. Ladapo, MD, PhD, is Professor of Medicine at the University of Florida and serves as Florida’s State Surgeon General. His research focuses on behavioral economic strategies to reduce cardiovascular risk in low-income and underserved populations. Clinically, he has primarily cared for hospitalized patients.

His work, supported by the National Institutes of Health and the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation, has included clinical trials on weight loss, smoking cessation, and cardiovascular disease prevention among people living with HIV. His studies have been published in leading medical journals, including The Journal of the American Medical Association, Journal of the American College of Cardiology, and Annals of Internal Medicine. His commentary on health policy and public health has appeared in The Washington Post, The Wall Street Journal, and USA Today. Before joining the University of Florida, he was a tenured Associate Professor at UCLA’s David Geffen School of Medicine.

Dr. Ladapo graduated from Wake Forest University and earned both his MD and PhD in Health Policy from Harvard University. He completed his internal medicine training at Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center, where he received the Harvard Medical School Class of 2012 Resident Teaching Award and the Daniel E. Ford Award in Health Services and Outcomes Research from Johns Hopkins University.